Discussion:
M O eleven
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T&L
2005-02-15 02:48:21 UTC
Permalink
After seeing a commercial advertising Ocean's 12, I couldn't help
thinking of Maudlin's 11. The first time I saw it, I didn't connect it
to Ocean's 11 until quite sometime later....made it way more funny once
I actually put the two together.

Tim
Justin Pate
2005-02-15 03:39:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by T&L
After seeing a commercial advertising Ocean's 12, I couldn't help
thinking of Maudlin's 11. The first time I saw it, I didn't connect it
to Ocean's 11 until quite sometime later....made it way more funny once
I actually put the two together.
Tim
It can be annoying at times, because there's a lot of corny lines in
Maudlin's Eleven, but I think it pays off with a hilarious ending. For
example one of the corny lines:

"Peace of cake - with frosting on it!" *rest of the crew laughs
hysterically*

But for all I know, those dumb lines were originally in the movie and SCTV
was just parodying that. I've learned that you always have to assume when
SCTV did something weird, it was for a reason. Usually they didn't just
have a "brain fart" all of a sudden and did something dumb. It was planned
all along....
Dr. Mabuse
2005-02-15 03:57:47 UTC
Permalink
The corny line that has always stuck with me is, "The *niece* is
*nice*!" I don't know why, but just the leering way William B. says it
is funny. I also like the silly "shadow" credits at the beginning,
with William B. trying to run and puffing as if he's having a heart
attack, and Bobby Bittman throwing his gun at an assailant and then
doing that "How are ya????" gesture with his hands.

Wanda
George Hiebert
2005-02-21 19:08:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dr. Mabuse
The corny line that has always stuck with me is, "The *niece* is
*nice*!" I don't know why, but just the leering way William B. says it
is funny.
Hee hee, I love that line too, Candy's delivery makes it.
a***@excite.com
2005-02-15 14:33:06 UTC
Permalink
<<<It can be annoying at times, because there's a lot of corny lines in

Maudlin's Eleven, but I think it pays off with a hilarious ending. For

example one of the corny lines:

"Peace of cake - with frosting on it!" *rest of the crew laughs
hysterically*


But for all I know, those dumb lines were originally in the movie and
SCTV
was just parodying that. I've learned that you always have to assume
when
SCTV did something weird, it was for a reason. Usually they didn't
just
have a "brain fart" all of a sudden and did something dumb. It was
planned
all along.... >>>>


They were parody-ing the Rat Pack of the early 60's. You probably know
this already, but a gang of emotionally pre-adolescent males used to
hang out in Las Vegas. Frank Sinatra, Dean Martin, Sammy Davis, Jr
("The Sammy Maudlin Show" is is a take-off on the Sammy Davis Jr. Show,
which was unintentionally hilarious in its over-the-top emotion and
sentimentality), Joey Bishop, Peter Lawford, and one or two others. A
few females, starlettes Shirley McClaine and Angie Dickenson among
them, were allowed to hang with the Pack because they didn't object to
getting passed around the Pack members. They had a pecking order and
they all kissed Sinatra's ass, Davis especially. Anything Sinatra said
the rest of the Pack would die over. I think the "peice of cake" line
was Maudlin's, who is playing the Sinatra role in the sketch.
Everybody laughing at Sinatra/Maudlin's lame attempt at humor is
satirizing the a big part of the whole Rat Pack "thing". You're
correct in assuming it was intentional.

That sketch flat-out nails that whole era, pre-Vietnam swinging 60s. I
show it to people who were around in those days (I'm old enough to
remember them, just coming into my own, and I thought those goofballs
were really cool at the time), and the ones who were tuned into pop
culture of that era just howl. The credits, the music, the lighting
and set design, costumes, it is as close to perfect parody as it gets.
And it uses the SCTV characters in the Rat Pack roles, not to mention
Johnny Puleo and the Harmonica Gang (who ever thought of getting the
cast to 11 by adding them is a Hall of Famer). Take it from someone
who was there then (barely), "Maudlin's Eleven" ("Vic Arpegio, Private
Eye" too) is the stuff of genius.
Lola
2005-02-15 19:12:08 UTC
Permalink
But the thing is, Sinatra and Dean Martin were incredibly gifted
singers. Sammy Davis, Jr. was incredibly talented. It was also an era
when a black entertainer could not do much more than shuffle and say
"yes, boss" -- and Sammy Davis Jr. was trying to be accepted, and
white. So in addition to the banal sentimentality there was an
undercurrent of tension and seriousness to the era that just begged to
be lampooned. The Sammy Maudlin Show kills me all the time -- when
they all put their pinky to their eyes to wipe away fake tears -- the
Rat Pack did that. The Rat Pack laughed too hard, and inappropriately,
at "in jokes" that just weren't funny. SCTV nailed it all. The
original movie, Ocean's 11, is a TERRIBLE movie. It's wonderful in how
terrible it is, and Maudlin's 11 just really gets the tone.

But the real focus of the parody is not the three most talented members
of the Rat Pack: SCTV lampoons the hangers-on, the ones who ached to
be famous and accepted. They never go after Dean Martin, or Sinatra
(except for the Frank Insence at Christmas).
a***@excite.com
2005-02-16 13:14:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lola
But the thing is, Sinatra and Dean Martin were incredibly gifted
singers. Sammy Davis, Jr. was incredibly talented. It was also an era
when a black entertainer could not do much more than shuffle and say
"yes, boss" -- and Sammy Davis Jr. was trying to be accepted, and
white. So in addition to the banal sentimentality there was an
undercurrent of tension and seriousness to the era that just begged to
be lampooned. The Sammy Maudlin Show kills me all the time -- when
they all put their pinky to their eyes to wipe away fake tears -- the
Rat Pack did that. The Rat Pack laughed too hard, and
inappropriately,
Post by Lola
at "in jokes" that just weren't funny. SCTV nailed it all. The
original movie, Ocean's 11, is a TERRIBLE movie. It's wonderful in how
terrible it is, and Maudlin's 11 just really gets the tone.
But the real focus of the parody is not the three most talented members
of the Rat Pack: SCTV lampoons the hangers-on, the ones who ached to
be famous and accepted. They never go after Dean Martin, or Sinatra
(except for the Frank Insence at Christmas).
I couldn't agree with you more on Sinatra. As a singer, he exists in
his own universe. Martin's singing was two notches or so below Frank
but was a better actor, especially in comedy. Sammy was very good and
versatile indeed, he could dance and sing terrifically well, and wasn't
a half-bad actor (didn't he play the drums too?). Sammy, and all black
performers (and people) of his day, had to put up with a ton of
bulllshit. One of the best things about Sinatra was his support for
Sammy, and other black entertainers, on things like getting into hotels
and restaurants, most of which in those days wouldn't serve
African-Americans. Frank owed a lot to black performers like Billie
Holiday and Louis Armstrong, and admitted as much and helped out a lot.


I read people criticizing Sinatra's and Davis's relationship, but I
don't think Frank treated him any worse than than he treated most
people. The racial "humor" was just that, as far as I can determine,
an attempt at humor. It looks cruel now (I find it embarassing now),
but in those days there was never a peep about race relations in
mainstream media when blacks and whites shared a stage, as infrequently
as that was. Race was the elephant in the room no one would
acknowledge. At least Frank and Sammy did acknowledged it, and by
doing a latter-day minstral show, put it out in the open for the masses
to chew on in a non-threatening way. I'm sure a lot of the laughter
was guilty, but the exposure was by-and-large beneficial to race
relations. That said, they did have a "complicated" relationship. I
understand that Sammy was even more obsequious with Sinatra than the
rest of the Rat Pack was, and Frank did boss him around.

The original "Ocean's 11" is even worse than the remake. It's
unintentionally funny as time capsule. SCTV does indeed completely
nail it. And while I don't think SCTV went after Sinatra the way, say,
Phil Hartman did on SNL, any portrayal of that time and place drags
Frank into it by association. Isn't the pinky to the eye just the
best? In those days it wasn't only a way to show how much more fun
these hipsters were having than the rest of us, but a way to show off
their snazzy pinky rings. I die every time I see that.

Has anyone here ever seen the old Sammy Davis Jr. talk show? It was
worse than you could imagine. Sammy was always convulsing in laughter
and slapping his leg. He would have these Vegas acts like Sandler and
Young, and would invite them over to the couch, and they were just
awful. Or "funny man" Shecky Green, a really unfunny guy, on the couch
singing "My Yiddishe Momme" to phony tears all round. Beyond insipid
and maudlin. My wife, who grew up without a television, really enjoys
bits like "The Sammy Maudlin Show" and "Ocena's 11" but to her they're
just funny bits. To a tv addict kid like I was, who didn't know any
better than to sit through tyhat crap, they're killer.

Anybody know who wrote them? "Maudlin's 11", "Vic Arpegio, Private
Eye" had to have been written by the same person.
Dr. Mabuse
2005-02-16 18:34:31 UTC
Permalink
I recall reading a newspaper story about SCTV at the time it was being
made, and as far as I could tell, it was Joe who was the fanatic for
obscure old movies, and who was the driving force behind all these
parodies. In fact, the writer gave the impression that some of this
stuff was SO obscure, it really couldn't have much of an audience, but
it was Joe's obsession and the rest of the cast went along with it. I
doubt that was true. I don't think the other performers would have
agreed to do something they didn't think was good, just to "humour"
another member of the cast. But maybe they recognized this as HIS
particular area of expertise. I think it might have been "Maudlin's
11" they were actually filming at the time of the story I was reading,
but I could be wrong about that. There were other movies I'd never
heard of, too. But I remember them ending the story with someone
saying they were doing a parody of this old unheard-of movie, and just
shrugging, as if to say, "Yeah, believe it or not."

Wanda
George Hiebert
2005-02-21 19:07:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dr. Mabuse
I recall reading a newspaper story about SCTV at the time it was being
made, and as far as I could tell, it was Joe who was the fanatic for
obscure old movies, and who was the driving force behind all these
parodies. In fact, the writer gave the impression that some of this
stuff was SO obscure, it really couldn't have much of an audience, but
it was Joe's obsession and the rest of the cast went along with it.
I always thought it was Joe who was behind all the obscure stuff, I knew
there was something about him I liked.
Personally I loved the obscure stuff, if you got it, you felt like you were
part of a special club or something. Same reason I'm an MST3K fan, all the
obscure references they throw out there. If you happen to get the ref,
you're laughing pretty hard. It's the old adage of the writers putting in
stuff that makes them personally laugh, not pandering to the lowest common
dominator type humour for the masses. This may not result in a wildly
popular show, but at least it's actually funny.
Justin Pate
2005-02-21 19:29:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by George Hiebert
I always thought it was Joe who was behind all the obscure stuff, I knew
there was something about him I liked.
Personally I loved the obscure stuff, if you got it, you felt like you were
part of a special club or something. Same reason I'm an MST3K fan, all the
obscure references they throw out there. If you happen to get the ref,
you're laughing pretty hard. It's the old adage of the writers putting in
stuff that makes them personally laugh, not pandering to the lowest common
dominator type humour for the masses. This may not result in a wildly
popular show, but at least it's actually funny.
The creators of MST3K were the wisest people in history, because they got
paid to sit around and make smart-alecky remarks while watching bad movies
and other bad films. My favorite hobby is watching TV shows and giving
sarcastic, smart-alecky comments while watching them. Actually getting paid
to do that would be living the sweet life.
T&L
2005-02-25 23:39:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Justin Pate
Post by George Hiebert
I always thought it was Joe who was behind all the obscure stuff, I knew
there was something about him I liked.
Personally I loved the obscure stuff, if you got it, you felt like you
were
Post by George Hiebert
part of a special club or something. Same reason I'm an MST3K fan, all the
obscure references they throw out there. If you happen to get the ref,
you're laughing pretty hard. It's the old adage of the writers putting in
stuff that makes them personally laugh, not pandering to the lowest common
dominator type humour for the masses. This may not result in a wildly
popular show, but at least it's actually funny.
The creators of MST3K were the wisest people in history, because they got
paid to sit around and make smart-alecky remarks while watching bad movies
and other bad films. My favorite hobby is watching TV shows and giving
sarcastic, smart-alecky comments while watching them. Actually getting paid
to do that would be living the sweet life.
I love doing that to shows myself. I usually get told to shut up, or leave the
room after about 5 minutes.

m***@aol.com
2005-02-16 01:24:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by T&L
After seeing a commercial advertising Ocean's 12, I couldn't help
thinking of Maudlin's 11. The first time I saw it, I didn't connect it
to Ocean's 11 until quite sometime later....made it way more funny once
I actually put the two together.
Tim
Is Maudlin's Eleven going to be part of the upcoming DVD release? I
saw it when it originally aired in the 80's, but having not seen Oceans
Eleven at the time, I didn't understand what they were spoofing. Now
that the original Oceans Eleven is one of my favorite cheesefests (and
much better than the remake IMO), I would probably laugh my ass off at
Maudlin's Eleven.
s***@sbcglobal.net
2005-02-16 02:43:29 UTC
Permalink
That Niece is nice was said in a Shemp short of the Stooges.The line
I like the most from Sammy : BINGO DINGO!.On 15 Feb 2005 17:24:43
Post by m***@aol.com
Post by T&L
After seeing a commercial advertising Ocean's 12, I couldn't help
thinking of Maudlin's 11. The first time I saw it, I didn't connect
it
Post by T&L
to Ocean's 11 until quite sometime later....made it way more funny
once
Post by T&L
I actually put the two together.
Tim
Is Maudlin's Eleven going to be part of the upcoming DVD release? I
saw it when it originally aired in the 80's, but having not seen Oceans
Eleven at the time, I didn't understand what they were spoofing. Now
that the original Oceans Eleven is one of my favorite cheesefests (and
much better than the remake IMO), I would probably laugh my ass off at
Maudlin's Eleven.
a***@excite.com
2005-02-16 20:11:59 UTC
Permalink
<<<Is Maudlin's Eleven going to be part of the upcoming DVD release? I

saw it when it originally aired in the 80's, but having not seen Oceans

Eleven at the time, I didn't understand what they were spoofing. Now
that the original Oceans Eleven is one of my favorite cheesefests (and
much better than the remake IMO), I would probably laugh my ass off at
Maudlin's Eleven. >>>


You'll laugh alright. Believe me, you'll laugh.
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